Hybrid Learning: Improving the Virtual Elements Cindy Huggett joins us to discuss how trainers stuck with hybrid classrooms can optimize their virtual elements, and a roadmap for moving to blended learning. TranscriptTom Moriarty: 00:00:01 Welcome, you made it to the Secret Society of Tom Moriarty: 00:00:03 Success! In this not-so-secret podcast, we interview L&D Tom Moriarty: 00:00:07 changemakers about how they […] Cindy Huggett joins us to discuss how trainers stuck with hybrid classrooms can optimize their virtual elements, and a roadmap for moving to blended learning. TranscriptTom Moriarty: 00:00:01 Welcome, you made it to the Secret Society of Tom Moriarty: 00:00:03 Success! In this not-so-secret podcast, we interview L&D Tom Moriarty: 00:00:07 changemakers about how they approach the evolving corporate Tom Moriarty: 00:00:10 environment and cultivate their own careers. We hope that from Tom Moriarty: 00:00:14 their stories, you find lessons and inspirations to make Tom Moriarty: 00:00:17 yourself, your people and your organization's more successful. Tom Moriarty: 00:00:21 In this first season, we're exploring topic of hybrid learning: 00:00:24 what that means at different organizations, why it learning: 00:00:27 is increasingly important, and how L&D leaders can invest in learning: 00:00:30 the right resources to best leverage it. Today, we're learning: 00:00:35 discussing what good hybrid learning looks like. Cindy learning: 00:00:38 Huggett, author and virtual training expert is joining us to learning: 00:00:41 discuss definitions what most organizations are doing today learning: 00:00:44 and where L&D leaders need to invest in order to make sure learning: 00:00:47 their hybrid programs actually achieve their learning and learning: 00:00:50 business outcomes. Cindy, welcome. Cindy Huggett: 00:00:53 Thank you so much for having me, Tom. Tom Moriarty: 00:00:56 So Cindy, you know, before we jump into the Tom Moriarty: 00:00:59 podcast itself, could you just share a little bit about your Tom Moriarty: 00:01:02 background? Cindy Huggett: 00:01:03 Sure. I think the thing your listeners will be Cindy Huggett: 00:01:06 most interested in is that I've been doing hybrid and virtual Cindy Huggett: 00:01:10 learning for the last 20 years. I was working inside an Cindy Huggett: 00:01:14 organization in the early 2000s, told to cut my budget, stop Cindy Huggett: 00:01:18 traveling but still provide training to my global audience. Cindy Huggett: 00:01:21 So I started using a really early version of WebEx to Cindy Huggett: 00:01:26 provide training. And I ended up going out on my own thinking I'd Cindy Huggett: 00:01:30 do some HR and training consulting. And I kept getting Cindy Huggett: 00:01:33 asked Cindy, how are you doing this virtual thing? And so I Cindy Huggett: 00:01:36 started writing and speaking and teaching and consulting on how Cindy Huggett: 00:01:40 to do virtual well. Needless to say, the last two years have Cindy Huggett: 00:01:43 been very busy. And it's been a lot of fun to work with clients Cindy Huggett: 00:01:47 around the globe and helping them do virtual training and Cindy Huggett: 00:01:50 hybrid learning really well. Tom Moriarty: 00:01:52 That's great. I'd like to start to just level set Tom Moriarty: 00:01:54 this conversation with some definition. So let's start with this fun buzzword: 00:01:58 hybrid learning. What does that mean to this fun buzzword: 00:02:02 you, Cindy? Cindy Huggett: 00:02:03 Well, for me, hybrid learning in a workplace Cindy Huggett: 00:02:06 setting means a synchronous event, a live event, where some Cindy Huggett: 00:02:11 of the participants are in person, and some of the Cindy Huggett: 00:02:13 participants are remote. And I think it's important to start Cindy Huggett: 00:02:18 the conversation here, Tom, because as I've been talking and Cindy Huggett: 00:02:22 researching and writing about hybrid for the past several Cindy Huggett: 00:02:25 years, in just the last few months, I've had a number of Cindy Huggett: 00:02:29 people say things like, Well, what about the assignment? Or Cindy Huggett: 00:02:31 what about the self led part? And it's led me to realize that, Cindy Huggett: 00:02:36 especially in a university setting or a college setting, Cindy Huggett: 00:02:40 that in that context, hybrid means a curriculum that has some Cindy Huggett: 00:02:47 synchronous and some asynchronous. So when we say the Cindy Huggett: 00:02:50 word hybrid, it's really important to find out what's Cindy Huggett: 00:02:53 your definition of hybrid? Are you talking about a curriculum a Cindy Huggett: 00:02:57 journey? Are you talking about a single event that happens to Cindy Huggett: 00:03:01 have an audience in different locations? And so I refer to Cindy Huggett: 00:03:05 hybrid, as that latter definition, the synchronous Cindy Huggett: 00:03:09 event that has audiences, some in person, some remote, and Cindy Huggett: 00:03:15 let's let's refer to hybrid that way. Tom Moriarty: 00:03:18 That's great. Blended learning. What does that Tom Moriarty: 00:03:21 mean to you? Cindy Huggett: 00:03:21 Oh, there's definitely overlap, because Cindy Huggett: 00:03:24 blended learning in a workplace setting is a journey. It's a Cindy Huggett: 00:03:29 curriculum that happens to have some self led and some in person Cindy Huggett: 00:03:35 or instructor led could be online, and more likely than Cindy Huggett: 00:03:39 not, is online. But it's this intentionally designed Cindy Huggett: 00:03:43 curriculum that has multiple modalities. So for example, if Cindy Huggett: 00:03:47 I'm learning how to be a customer service agent, I might Cindy Huggett: 00:03:52 do some self study on my own, I might go to some classes, I may Cindy Huggett: 00:03:55 do some practice and some coaching. And it's the Cindy Huggett: 00:03:57 combination of all of that, that creates the dedicated blended Cindy Huggett: 00:04:02 learning curriculum. Now, like we were just talking about in a Cindy Huggett: 00:04:06 university setting, they call that hybrid, but we in the Cindy Huggett: 00:04:10 workplace or corporate learning setting are going to call that Cindy Huggett: 00:04:13 blended. Tom Moriarty: 00:04:14 And the last one I like to dive into is hybrid Tom Moriarty: 00:04:17 classroom. What does that mean to you? Cindy Huggett: 00:04:20 So it's an interesting term, hybrid Cindy Huggett: 00:04:22 classroom. There are certain vendors out there and especially Cindy Huggett: 00:04:28 recently who have become quite popular who offer technology Cindy Huggett: 00:04:32 packages that are dedicated hybrid classrooms. It may be a Cindy Huggett: 00:04:38 camera or a camera bar, or maybe an audio system, or a wall of Cindy Huggett: 00:04:46 video screens where the hybrid classroom a dedicated room that Cindy Huggett: 00:04:52 makes doing hybrid easy. One small example of that is zoom Cindy Huggett: 00:04:57 rooms. When we think of the product zoom that we're even Cindy Huggett: 00:05:01 using right now to record this conversation, we think of it as Cindy Huggett: 00:05:05 a synchronous event, there's a product, Zoom rooms, most of the Cindy Huggett: 00:05:09 major software vendors who create virtual or video Cindy Huggett: 00:05:14 conferencing are coming out with this type of technology. So when Cindy Huggett: 00:05:19 I think of a hybrid classroom, I think of a dedicated classroom Cindy Huggett: 00:05:23 that makes doing hybrid learning or having hybrid meetings Cindy Huggett: 00:05:27 easier. Tom Moriarty: 00:05:28 If my notes are correct, for the purposes of our Tom Moriarty: 00:05:30 conversation, hybrid learning is a live event, right, where you Tom Moriarty: 00:05:35 have an audience that might be physically in front of you and Tom Moriarty: 00:05:38 an audience also might be distributed. Whereas blended Tom Moriarty: 00:05:41 learning, that's really about your curriculum. It's the Tom Moriarty: 00:05:44 curriculum journey, which is different than an actual live Tom Moriarty: 00:05:47 event. And then the classroom, as you put it, is really kind of Tom Moriarty: 00:05:51 a product or a tool or a location that's designed to make Tom Moriarty: 00:05:55 facilitating that hybrid learning as easy as possible. Cindy Huggett: 00:05:59 Absolutely. And the one thing I would add for Cindy Huggett: 00:06:02 the hybrid classroom, even though there are dedicated Cindy Huggett: 00:06:05 vendors who are creating certain rooms that make it easy, you can Cindy Huggett: 00:06:10 also do it on your own. If you have any conference room, right, Cindy Huggett: 00:06:14 any conference room where you set up with a laptop, or an Cindy Huggett: 00:06:18 audio connection, or a video connection, you can make that a Cindy Huggett: 00:06:21 hybrid classroom, but it's a dedicated space. Tom Moriarty: 00:06:24 I love that idea of a DIY hybrid classroom, I Tom Moriarty: 00:06:26 think we'll get back to that later in our conversation. So as Tom Moriarty: 00:06:30 you shared with the audience, this is your space. This is your Tom Moriarty: 00:06:33 area of expertise. It's where you've been working and living, Tom Moriarty: 00:06:35 even before March 2020. So let me ask you this. Based on your Tom Moriarty: 00:06:38 research, you know, in the state of virtual training report that Tom Moriarty: 00:06:42 you've shared, sounds like most organizations who say that Tom Moriarty: 00:06:45 they're doing hybrid learning, are really delivering classroom Tom Moriarty: 00:06:50 training to a blend of people remote, kind of that your Tom Moriarty: 00:06:54 definition of hybrid learning, right? They're calling it Tom Moriarty: 00:06:56 blended, some are calling it hybrid. I want to really, really Tom Moriarty: 00:07:00 focus the entire discussion on how do you maximize the Tom Moriarty: 00:07:03 delivery? In that setting? How do you make it as effective as Tom Moriarty: 00:07:07 possible in terms of achieving that business outcome? So first, Tom Moriarty: 00:07:11 maybe you've got an L&D professional who's trying to Tom Moriarty: 00:07:14 balance that decision of, Hey, should I deliver this with a Tom Moriarty: 00:07:17 hybrid learning event? Or should I deliver this with in person? Tom Moriarty: 00:07:21 What are some of the benefits that they'll get from choosing Cindy Huggett: 00:07:24 So I have a big smile on my face. Because back Cindy Huggett: 00:07:24 the hybrid? Cindy Huggett: 00:07:27 in 2016, one of my books, the Virtual Training Tools and Cindy Huggett: 00:07:31 Templates book, I wrote about hybrid learning, and I actually Cindy Huggett: 00:07:36 wrote, don't do it, I wrote, this is something that if you Tom Moriarty: 00:07:40 That's great. It's a... It's not the entire I think Tom Moriarty: 00:07:41 can avoid it, avoid it. And if though you have to do it, then Tom Moriarty: 00:07:45 here's how you do it well. Here's here's what we can do. Tom Moriarty: 00:07:50 And fast forward to 2022. Believe it or not, that is still Tom Moriarty: 00:07:54 my recommendation that if you have an audience that is in Tom Moriarty: 00:07:58 person together, co located, and you have an audience that's Tom Moriarty: 00:08:03 remote, if you have the time, the resources, the energy, the Tom Moriarty: 00:08:08 ability to have let's take a training class topic, any Tom Moriarty: 00:08:12 training class topic, and to do an in person version of it, and Tom Moriarty: 00:08:17 to do an online or virtual version of it, do that. Now the Tom Moriarty: 00:08:21 reality is most organizations don't have those type of Tom Moriarty: 00:08:25 resources. We're not able to say, "I want to offer the Tom Moriarty: 00:08:30 management development program in person. And I want to offer Tom Moriarty: 00:08:34 the management development program online." And so the Tom Moriarty: 00:08:38 reality of how we're working today with work hasn't stopped, Tom Moriarty: 00:08:43 but work location has changed. Some people are in an office, Tom Moriarty: 00:08:48 some are remote, some are always from this point forward, going Tom Moriarty: 00:08:53 to be remote or have the choice of whether or not they're Tom Moriarty: 00:08:57 remote, you have a good strong internet connection and a Tom Moriarty: 00:09:01 laptop, or access to the programs you need. You can work Tom Moriarty: 00:09:06 from anywhere. So when we talk about maximizing what should we Tom Moriarty: 00:09:10 do to embrace hybrid learning is let's recognize just like you Tom Moriarty: 00:09:15 can work from anywhere you can learn from anywhere, and we're Tom Moriarty: 00:09:20 going to get deeper into more of the how, but recognize that we Tom Moriarty: 00:09:25 want to allow our remote audience those who are working Tom Moriarty: 00:09:29 remotely by choice or for whatever reason that is that Tom Moriarty: 00:09:33 they can participate in the learning program as well. We now Tom Moriarty: 00:09:38 have the technology that allows that to happen. Facilitators who Tom Moriarty: 00:09:43 can get the skills to do that well designed that can be Tom Moriarty: 00:09:47 effective for those dual audiences so we can embrace it. Tom Moriarty: 00:09:51 We just need to recognize that it is a dedicated effort on Tom Moriarty: 00:09:56 behalf of many stakeholders to make it worthwhile Tom Moriarty: 00:10:04 most people were expecting. But I love that I think that the, Tom Moriarty: 00:10:07 you know, the reality is that, you know, as you said, faced Tom Moriarty: 00:10:11 with other options, this wouldn't be your first choice. Tom Moriarty: 00:10:15 But faced with the reality of many people's circumstances, Tom Moriarty: 00:10:20 given the fact that much of the workforce or some parts of most Tom Moriarty: 00:10:24 people's workforces will now be and likely remain remote for Tom Moriarty: 00:10:28 some period of time. But you've got an audience, you've got to Tom Moriarty: 00:10:31 be able to reach. Right. And I think that now, as you've you so Tom Moriarty: 00:10:35 beautifully said, the benefits are a growing skill set and Tom Moriarty: 00:10:40 toolset, to be able to do that and deliver it well, in a way Tom Moriarty: 00:10:45 that's impactful, that creates an outcome. So let's get into Tom Moriarty: 00:10:48 that. But I want to start, maybe not with what works. But what do Tom Moriarty: 00:10:52 you see that doesn't work? I feel like sometimes that can be Tom Moriarty: 00:10:55 a more actionable takeaway. So what are some of the big Tom Moriarty: 00:10:57 mistakes you see, in hybrid learning delivery? Cindy Huggett: 00:11:00 I see two big mistakes in hybrid learning Cindy Huggett: 00:11:03 delivery. And the first one is facilitators who pay attention Cindy Huggett: 00:11:09 to the audience right in front of them if they're in the room, Cindy Huggett: 00:11:12 they're co located. And yes, they have the remote audience, Cindy Huggett: 00:11:16 and they know that they're there. But whether consciously Cindy Huggett: 00:11:19 or subconsciously, they don't put the emphasis on them. Which Cindy Huggett: 00:11:23 really leads me to the second mistake. And when we think about Cindy Huggett: 00:11:26 preparation for an event, many years ago, when we only did in Cindy Huggett: 00:11:32 person events, your preparation was on your content, your Cindy Huggett: 00:11:35 preparation was on what's the topic, whether my outcomes, what Cindy Huggett: 00:11:39 are the activities? Are we really focused in on that. And Cindy Huggett: 00:11:43 then when everyone went virtual, when when we started doing Cindy Huggett: 00:11:46 virtual training, the preparation was on the Cindy Huggett: 00:11:49 technology on what software will I use? Does everyone have a Cindy Huggett: 00:11:54 webcam or headset? Right? both hardware and software, the Cindy Huggett: 00:11:57 technology was the focus, content was still important, but Cindy Huggett: 00:12:01 the focus became technology. Now that we're in a hybrid learning Cindy Huggett: 00:12:06 environment, where we have audiences in different Cindy Huggett: 00:12:09 locations, the focus of our preparation needs to be on the Cindy Huggett: 00:12:14 participant experience. We with empathy, think through what's Cindy Huggett: 00:12:19 the audience experience going to be like our in person audience, Cindy Huggett: 00:12:24 are they going to have devices to connect in? What's that going Cindy Huggett: 00:12:29 to be like in the room? Can we get them on camera? My remote audience: 00:12:32 What's the experience going to be like for them? Are audience: 00:12:36 we going to ask them to be on camera? Are we going to modify audience: 00:12:40 activities to ensure that they feel included? And again, it's audience: 00:12:45 not that the technology is not important? It's not that the audience: 00:12:47 content is not important, but our shift in focus. So the audience: 00:12:51 mistake that I see made is not shifting focus of where our audience: 00:12:55 preparation needs to be, and especially as hybrid is new for audience: 00:12:58 many organizations. We're getting used to it the audience: 00:13:03 preparation that goes into it being successful. There needs to audience: 00:13:07 be emphasis on that. Tom Moriarty: 00:13:09 I think that that specific takeaway on shifting Tom Moriarty: 00:13:14 the focus to the participant experience is a fantastic one. Tom Moriarty: 00:13:19 Let me ask you one follow up question. The first mistake is Tom Moriarty: 00:13:22 the facilitator, the facilitator, not giving the Tom Moriarty: 00:13:26 right focus or engagement with the remote audience versus the Tom Moriarty: 00:13:30 audience, right for what can facilitators do? What are some Tom Moriarty: 00:13:34 tips or tricks you might have for them to try to ensure Tom Moriarty: 00:13:37 they're better balancing addressing their complete Tom Moriarty: 00:13:40 audience? Cindy Huggett: 00:13:41 That's a great question. And there are a couple Cindy Huggett: 00:13:43 of things that facilitators can do when they've got a hybrid Cindy Huggett: 00:13:46 audience. Perhaps, first of all, we should just call out the Cindy Huggett: 00:13:50 assumption that the facilitator is in the room that they're co Cindy Huggett: 00:13:54 located because in some organizations, it may be the Cindy Huggett: 00:13:58 facilitator who's remote. So if you have that scenario, you want Cindy Huggett: 00:14:02 to designate an in room moderator or somebody who is co Cindy Huggett: 00:14:06 located with your audience, and they can be your eyes and ears. Cindy Huggett: 00:14:11 So let's assume that the facilitator is in the classroom Cindy Huggett: 00:14:15 in with the co located participants. What are some Cindy Huggett: 00:14:20 things that they can do number one, keep a remote first Cindy Huggett: 00:14:22 mentality? By that, I mean, if there's a question that's asked Cindy Huggett: 00:14:27 that they get the remote audience to respond first, or if Cindy Huggett: 00:14:33 they're using the camera to present a short segment that Cindy Huggett: 00:14:38 they're looking at the camera screen as opposed to looking at Cindy Huggett: 00:14:42 the in person audience. It's not that you never look at the in Cindy Huggett: 00:14:45 person audience but we pay attention to the camera lens and Cindy Huggett: 00:14:49 we focus our eyes so that the remote audience feels like Cindy Huggett: 00:14:54 they're part of the conversation. If in person Cindy Huggett: 00:14:58 audience members starts speaking to one another, and they can't Cindy Huggett: 00:15:02 be heard on the audio, the facilitator could either pause Cindy Huggett: 00:15:06 that conversation to make sure there's a microphone or some Cindy Huggett: 00:15:10 other, perhaps repetition of what's being said. So the remote Cindy Huggett: 00:15:15 audience feels like they're there. And to, to follow on a Cindy Huggett: 00:15:21 sports analogy, when you think about any type of big sporting Cindy Huggett: 00:15:27 event that you're watching on television, that you're not Cindy Huggett: 00:15:29 actually there, you listen to the announcers, who are talking Cindy Huggett: 00:15:34 about it. And the goal of the announcer, is to help you feel Cindy Huggett: 00:15:38 like you're there. They describe the crowd, they describe the Cindy Huggett: 00:15:41 scene, they describe what's happening, they use colorful Cindy Huggett: 00:15:44 language, to paint the picture of what's happening. And that's Cindy Huggett: 00:15:49 the same idea of what an in person facilitator can do to Cindy Huggett: 00:15:53 help the remote audience feel like they're there. For example, Cindy Huggett: 00:15:57 if there's a long pause, the facilitator could say something Cindy Huggett: 00:16:00 like, "Jane is getting ready to load some slides up," or "we're Cindy Huggett: 00:16:04 waiting for Adam to come back into the room," just that idea Cindy Huggett: 00:16:10 of helping the remote audience feel like they're there. Tom, I Cindy Huggett: 00:16:14 could keep going. I actually teach a workshop in how to Cindy Huggett: 00:16:16 facilitate hybrid events. And hopefully, that gives you an Cindy Huggett: 00:16:20 idea of a few quick things that take a little extra intention, a Cindy Huggett: 00:16:26 little extra effort, but go a long way to helping the remote Cindy Huggett: 00:16:30 audience feel like they're part of the class feel like they're Cindy Huggett: 00:16:34 part of the learning experience. Tom Moriarty: 00:16:36 Cindy, that's great. I love the energy, and I Tom Moriarty: 00:16:38 love some of the takeaways. Moving on. So we've talked about Tom Moriarty: 00:16:41 some of the common mistakes, we've talked about some things Tom Moriarty: 00:16:43 that you could do to address them. So let's say you've got an Tom Moriarty: 00:16:46 L&D department there, they know they're going to be serving a Tom Moriarty: 00:16:49 population that is a mix of in person and remote learners. Why Tom Moriarty: 00:16:52 should they consider adding other content delivery methods Tom Moriarty: 00:16:56 besides just the hybrid learning event into the mix to move Tom Moriarty: 00:17:02 towards a more blended model? Why is that something that they Tom Moriarty: 00:17:05 should consider given the context in our audience? Cindy Huggett: 00:17:07 Tom, I think that's the golden question for Cindy Huggett: 00:17:10 us to answer because our goal as learning departments is to help Cindy Huggett: 00:17:15 our audience learn, right, that's an obvious statement. But Cindy Huggett: 00:17:19 the reason we do any learning intervention in a training Cindy Huggett: 00:17:23 program, any sort of formalized learning effort is to help our Cindy Huggett: 00:17:30 audience to do something better to learn a new skill. And if we Cindy Huggett: 00:17:36 want that to happen, then we need to be thinking about the Cindy Huggett: 00:17:40 best way for them to learn. In my work in virtual training, Cindy Huggett: 00:17:44 something I hear over and over and over again, and I've heard Cindy Huggett: 00:17:48 it for years, is that "when my participants are multitasking, Cindy Huggett: 00:17:52 they don't answer questions." They're not paying attention, Cindy Huggett: 00:17:54 right? It sounds different in different contexts. But the Cindy Huggett: 00:17:57 general idea is how do we engage our remote audiences. And Cindy Huggett: 00:18:03 whether it's virtual, whether it's hybrid, we have when we Cindy Huggett: 00:18:07 think about the workforce today, a very capable set of adults who Cindy Huggett: 00:18:15 can do work and can can do work on their own right, the the Cindy Huggett: 00:18:19 future of remote and hybrid work is really asynchronous, allowing Cindy Huggett: 00:18:27 people to do things on their own. We've got overloaded Cindy Huggett: 00:18:30 plates, we've got overloaded schedules, we have so much. And Cindy Huggett: 00:18:35 part of the reason why people are multitasking or not engaging Cindy Huggett: 00:18:38 is that we're bringing them together for a live event, when Cindy Huggett: 00:18:43 what our goal is of trying to get them to learn what we're Cindy Huggett: 00:18:47 trying to do they could do on their own. Like, for example, Cindy Huggett: 00:18:52 are we bringing people together just to lecture ask them, why Cindy Huggett: 00:18:55 not record that and let them watch it on their own time, and Cindy Huggett: 00:18:58 then bring them together for q&a, bring them together for Cindy Huggett: 00:19:03 some practice, or discussion or dialogue about that topic? Or Cindy Huggett: 00:19:07 instead of bringing them together to do a demonstration, Cindy Huggett: 00:19:12 could we create a job aid? Could we create an asynchronous Cindy Huggett: 00:19:16 elearning? And I think, most learning departments, we need to Cindy Huggett: 00:19:20 think about how much learning can we create, that our learners Cindy Huggett: 00:19:26 can do on their own or in small cohorts, according to time that Cindy Huggett: 00:19:31 works for them in their work schedule. And I'm not saying Cindy Huggett: 00:19:35 make them do work on I don't know, after hours or the middle Cindy Huggett: 00:19:39 of the night, but things if this is important for their job and Cindy Huggett: 00:19:43 we're building an accountability, then we want to Cindy Huggett: 00:19:46 honor and respect the fact that they're adult learners and that Cindy Huggett: 00:19:49 they can take accountability for learning and so we're bringing Cindy Huggett: 00:19:52 them together, for collaboration for communication, for Cindy Huggett: 00:19:57 discussion, for practice, for feedback and we're making it Cindy Huggett: 00:20:02 count. So to answer your original question, why should a Cindy Huggett: 00:20:06 learning department be looking at creating other assets blended Cindy Huggett: 00:20:10 learning, because blended learning is largely self led Cindy Huggett: 00:20:15 asynchronous where we bring people together for the Cindy Huggett: 00:20:19 collaboration in the conversation. Tom Moriarty: 00:20:21 The interesting thing about that, that I was Tom Moriarty: 00:20:23 writing down as you're sharing your thoughts is it's it Tom Moriarty: 00:20:26 actually goes back to the biggest mistake that you Tom Moriarty: 00:20:28 mentioned just a moment ago, right? You mentioned, the second Tom Moriarty: 00:20:31 biggest mistake is not putting the participant experience Tom Moriarty: 00:20:35 first, specifically in the hybrid learning environment, and Tom Moriarty: 00:20:39 that in that event, where you've got a mix of remote and in Tom Moriarty: 00:20:41 person learners, but it almost sounds like you're saying, if I Tom Moriarty: 00:20:45 could make a leap here, the biggest mistake is not putting Tom Moriarty: 00:20:49 the participant experience first, also, as it relates to Tom Moriarty: 00:20:52 content design, because that's what I took from your, from your Tom Moriarty: 00:20:55 answer there. It's really about understanding, hey, you've got Tom Moriarty: 00:20:58 to a group of adults, you've got to deliver them content to Tom Moriarty: 00:21:02 achieve an outcome that fits in their schedule at the time that Tom Moriarty: 00:21:05 they need it. And maybe part of the way to think about that is Tom Moriarty: 00:21:08 think about their experience with the content first. And is Tom Moriarty: 00:21:12 this the right content experience, not just as direct Tom Moriarty: 00:21:14 classroom experience? Cindy Huggett: 00:21:16 Absolutely, absolutely. Tom Moriarty: 00:21:18 So I want to go back, you know, you are the Tom Moriarty: 00:21:21 expert. Of course, as they say, I want to go back to two teams Tom Moriarty: 00:21:26 that are kind of doubling down on delivering training to a Tom Moriarty: 00:21:29 hybrid group. So there, they know that they're going to Tom Moriarty: 00:21:31 deliver hybrid learning, they're going to do it consistently, Tom Moriarty: 00:21:34 they're going to invest in it, because they know they have this Tom Moriarty: 00:21:37 distributed workforce, it's going to be a mix of in person, Tom Moriarty: 00:21:42 and remote. So what I'd like to do is understand as that team Tom Moriarty: 00:21:48 exists today, where do they invest the most? Right, so I'll Tom Moriarty: 00:21:51 give you some categories, I'd like you to try to prioritize Tom Moriarty: 00:21:55 these three categories, where are some terms of investment for Tom Moriarty: 00:21:58 the L&D team. So one would be course development. The second Tom Moriarty: 00:22:02 would be technology that are better helps facilitate the Tom Moriarty: 00:22:06 delivery of a hybrid learning environment, or the third would Tom Moriarty: 00:22:10 be facilitation skills for the people who are actually Tom Moriarty: 00:22:13 facilitating. So if you had to prioritize, you know, an order Tom Moriarty: 00:22:17 of importance, one, two, or three, because, you know, not Tom Moriarty: 00:22:20 everybody can do all three, unfortunately, how would you Tom Moriarty: 00:22:23 prioritize those? And then how would you maybe help the Tom Moriarty: 00:22:27 audience think about how they should in the context of their Tom Moriarty: 00:22:30 business? Cindy Huggett: 00:22:31 It's so interesting that you asked this Cindy Huggett: 00:22:33 question, because in my annual State of Virtual Training Cindy Huggett: 00:22:37 report, one of the questions that I've asked over the last Cindy Huggett: 00:22:40 few years is, "what do you wish your organization did Cindy Huggett: 00:22:44 differently about virtual training?" Over and over and Cindy Huggett: 00:22:49 over again, I hear, "I don't have enough resources." And I Cindy Huggett: 00:22:52 hear that from designers, I hear that from facilitators, I hear Cindy Huggett: 00:22:57 that in multiple contexts. But the idea of resources for a Cindy Huggett: 00:23:03 designer that means I need time to develop training, develop Cindy Huggett: 00:23:09 learning experiences that are significant and meaningful and Cindy Huggett: 00:23:14 valuable. In other words, I can't just take a classroom Cindy Huggett: 00:23:19 training program and a slide deck and slap it into an online Cindy Huggett: 00:23:23 learning program and call it like, there's the... I need Cindy Huggett: 00:23:26 resources, I need time for do that. So that's a very important Cindy Huggett: 00:23:30 priority. The facilitators will say, "I need time to learn the Cindy Huggett: 00:23:35 technology, you're going to put me in a room with these Cindy Huggett: 00:23:40 technical components, I need to learn how they work, I need Cindy Huggett: 00:23:44 practice, I need the time to upskill myself." And they're Cindy Huggett: 00:23:50 also going to say we need to equip our participants, they Cindy Huggett: 00:23:54 need webcams or they need quality headsets, or they need Cindy Huggett: 00:23:57 better internet connectivity. Because the participant who Cindy Huggett: 00:24:01 can't stay connected to a learning program is obviously Cindy Huggett: 00:24:04 not learning. They're spending all their time and energy trying Cindy Huggett: 00:24:07 to just reconnect to the program. So the answer is Cindy Huggett: 00:24:12 resources. The resources that matter are going to depend on Cindy Huggett: 00:24:17 your organizational structure. Do you have a team of Cindy Huggett: 00:24:19 instructional designers or are you asking facilitators to do Cindy Huggett: 00:24:25 the design? What kind of infrastructure do you have for Cindy Huggett: 00:24:28 your participants? So when you think about the the Cindy Huggett: 00:24:32 infrastructure of the resources, if I had to pick a priority, I Cindy Huggett: 00:24:37 would invest in your facilitators, they're the ones Cindy Huggett: 00:24:40 that can make it work in any learning environment, but they Cindy Huggett: 00:24:45 need the skills to effectively engage remote audiences and in a Cindy Huggett: 00:24:51 hybrid environment to effectively engage both Cindy Huggett: 00:24:54 environments. We also want them to be so comfortable with the Cindy Huggett: 00:24:58 technology platforms where you using. For example, if they're Cindy Huggett: 00:25:01 using a collaboration whiteboard, we want them to be Cindy Huggett: 00:25:04 very skilled and able to explain it to participants so that Cindy Huggett: 00:25:09 participants can just use the whiteboard for the activity, and Cindy Huggett: 00:25:13 not be bogged down in trying to learn how the whiteboard works, Cindy Huggett: 00:25:17 right? It's not about the whiteboard, it's about the Cindy Huggett: 00:25:19 learning that's behind it. So if I had to prioritize facilitator Cindy Huggett: 00:25:24 upskilling facilitator technology, the next place I Cindy Huggett: 00:25:29 would go is to look at are my participants equipped with what Cindy Huggett: 00:25:32 they need? And do my designers have the skills and the time and Cindy Huggett: 00:25:36 the resources to create good quality, interactive learning? Tom Moriarty: 00:25:41 I like that's Cindy, I really appreciate that. Tom Moriarty: 00:25:43 I think that that's a path that I think would make most people Tom Moriarty: 00:25:46 successful. So I appreciate the the really clear framework and Tom Moriarty: 00:25:51 focus there. I do want to get back to something that we talked Tom Moriarty: 00:25:54 about way earlier that I loved as a term. I did want to make Tom Moriarty: 00:26:00 sure we picked your brain on before we wrapped up this Tom Moriarty: 00:26:03 conversation today. The DIY hybrid classroom. Let's let's Tom Moriarty: 00:26:10 talk about that a little bit. How do we how do we get you on Tom Moriarty: 00:26:12 HGTV doing DIY hybrid classrooms? Cindy Huggett: 00:26:15 Great idea. How fun would that be? So when we Cindy Huggett: 00:26:19 think about the equipment that you need, number one clear Cindy Huggett: 00:26:23 audio, creating an audio connection where everybody can Cindy Huggett: 00:26:28 be heard, and you've probably seen on TV, maybe work for an Cindy Huggett: 00:26:32 organization that has a room where there's a microphone and Cindy Huggett: 00:26:35 every seat. And that is a fantastic yet rare luxury to Cindy Huggett: 00:26:41 have. But we do want to think about where's the microphone Cindy Huggett: 00:26:45 placement? Where do we pick up the audio, number one. Number Cindy Huggett: 00:26:49 two, video? Do we have a camera in the room that everybody who Cindy Huggett: 00:26:54 is in person can be seen. And if not? Well, we have mobile Cindy Huggett: 00:26:59 devices, we have tablets, we have laptops with built in Cindy Huggett: 00:27:02 cameras, where are we going to position them? Now thinking Cindy Huggett: 00:27:05 about room positioning, if you place the camera at the front of Cindy Huggett: 00:27:10 the room, and you have a presenter or facilitator or Cindy Huggett: 00:27:13 speaker who is standing at the front of the room, it's probably Cindy Huggett: 00:27:17 going to pick up the back of their head. So thinking about Cindy Huggett: 00:27:20 the positioning of the camera where that camera is going to Cindy Huggett: 00:27:25 pick up anyone who is speaking or presenting. So perhaps you Cindy Huggett: 00:27:30 put it in the back of the room, or there are cameras that will Cindy Huggett: 00:27:34 swivel and turn based on where the audio is coming from. Cindy Huggett: 00:27:38 There's some pretty cool technology out there that could Cindy Huggett: 00:27:42 be employed or used. But can it take time to set up the audio Cindy Huggett: 00:27:47 and the video correctly? Now, I believe it's important that Cindy Huggett: 00:27:51 anyone who's in the room, a participant who's joining co Cindy Huggett: 00:27:55 located together has the same device or the same access to the Cindy Huggett: 00:28:00 technology that the remote learners do. So if I'm inviting Cindy Huggett: 00:28:04 learners and participants in person, I'm going to ask them to Cindy Huggett: 00:28:07 bring their laptop or bring their mobile device so that they Cindy Huggett: 00:28:11 can respond to a poll question or type in chat or use the Cindy Huggett: 00:28:15 electronic whiteboard. The catch is they can't connect to audio, Cindy Huggett: 00:28:19 if they connect to the audio, we're gonna have echo problems Cindy Huggett: 00:28:22 go lower. So little bit of a tech check, making sure that Cindy Huggett: 00:28:27 it's just one audio connection in the room, and then everyone Cindy Huggett: 00:28:31 else on equal playing field, but the same tools that everyone Cindy Huggett: 00:28:35 who's connected into the hybrid learning will have. Tom Moriarty: 00:28:38 So the DIY hybrid classroom sounds like making Tom Moriarty: 00:28:41 sure you've got your clear audio, camera, both quality and Tom Moriarty: 00:28:46 positioning. And then if you've got if you need to be Tom Moriarty: 00:28:48 resourceful with that, you know, don't be afraid of the good old Tom Moriarty: 00:28:51 cell phone, right. And then last, which I like as a Tom Moriarty: 00:28:56 takeaway, because I don't think it's always emphasized enough, Tom Moriarty: 00:28:58 I'm even thinking back to a hybrid learning session that I Tom Moriarty: 00:29:02 did for one of my teams in December. And that's the Tom Moriarty: 00:29:06 universal access to the technology. I think that's a Tom Moriarty: 00:29:08 great one. I think that ultimately, going back to your Tom Moriarty: 00:29:11 earlier takeaway, which is putting the experience of the Tom Moriarty: 00:29:15 remote learner first, you can't really do that if you don't have Tom Moriarty: 00:29:19 the full classroom engaged in the same places do the same Tom Moriarty: 00:29:22 technology. So I love that tip. I think that's a really good Tom Moriarty: 00:29:24 one. Cindy, before we wrap up, are there any closing thoughts Tom Moriarty: 00:29:29 or ideas or takeaways that you'd like to leave the audience with? Tom Moriarty: 00:29:34 You know, as it relates to the goal of delivering good hybrid Tom Moriarty: 00:29:38 learning? Cindy Huggett: 00:29:38 Tom, I can think of so many things I would love Cindy Huggett: 00:29:41 to keep talking about. But I know we have limited amount of Cindy Huggett: 00:29:45 time. And I think I would leave the listener with this. And that Cindy Huggett: 00:29:50 is to remember it's about the learning and it's about the Cindy Huggett: 00:29:53 learner. And if we remember that if we put ourselves in their Cindy Huggett: 00:29:57 shoes and think through what do they need to learn and how can Cindy Huggett: 00:30:00 we help enable that learning, then we're going to create Cindy Huggett: 00:30:05 value. And that's our goal as facilitators, trainers, Cindy Huggett: 00:30:09 presenters, designers, anybody in an l&d department, our goal Cindy Huggett: 00:30:13 is to add value to our learners. And so let's make sure we're Cindy Huggett: 00:30:17 doing that regardless of the environment that we're working Cindy Huggett: 00:30:20 in Tom Moriarty: 00:30:20 Create value for your learners. That's a perfect Tom Moriarty: 00:30:22 closing statement. I love that. Cindy, if our audience wants to Tom Moriarty: 00:30:25 learn more about you, where can they find you? Cindy Huggett: 00:30:29 The best place is to go to my website, which is Cindy Huggett: 00:30:32 Cindy huggett.com. I'm sure we'll put it in the show notes. Cindy Huggett: 00:30:35 I have a resource library out there full of different Cindy Huggett: 00:30:39 resources that are available, you can download, I facilitate Cindy Huggett: 00:30:42 workshops, I write books, I have a new book coming out later in Cindy Huggett: 00:30:46 2022, called the Facilitators Guide to Immersive, Blended and Cindy Huggett: 00:30:50 Hybrid Learning. So you want to be on the lookout for that. And Cindy Huggett: 00:30:54 I can't wait for everyone to see the resources that I've been Cindy Huggett: 00:30:58 working on specifically related to that. You'll also find me on Cindy Huggett: 00:31:02 Twitter and Linked In. Cindyhugg is my tagline. And you'll find Cindy Huggett: 00:31:06 me out there in both places. Tom Moriarty: 00:31:08 Cindy, thank you so much for your time, it's been Tom Moriarty: 00:31:11 great. We'll definitely have links to all your social Tom Moriarty: 00:31:13 avenues, as well as the website in the show notes. And thank you Tom Moriarty: 00:31:17 so much for your time. I hope this has been very impactful. We Tom Moriarty: 00:31:20 appreciate it. I hope you have an awesome rest of your day. Tom Moriarty: 00:31:23 The Secret Society of Success is hosted by Mimeo, the better way Tom Moriarty: 00:31:26 to print. Check out our sister podcast, Talk of the Trade, for Tom Moriarty: 00:31:30 tips and tricks for sales and marketing leaders. Visit